Wednesday, September 13, 2006

More Marin RE Agent Bloggers

Blogging by real estate agents and brokers seems to be the new thing for some of them. I like the theme this Marin agent chose for her blog... reminds me of something...

I left a comment on her top (9/12/06) post with a link to this blog...let's see how long it lasts. I posted it today at 2:55 PM.

32 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

I am so excited about her blog, I just want to mindlessly spend money.

Sep 13, 2006, 6:26:00 PM  
Blogger David said...

Hopefully longer the you can say 'housing bubble.'

Sep 13, 2006, 6:59:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Did you know that Blogger uses templates? I doubt very much that this was done with any malice, it is very likely she didn't even see your site. If you take a moment to scroll through the millions of blogs on blogger I'm sure you'll find thousands of other sites that are using the same template. I think this is just a simple coincidence.

Sep 13, 2006, 8:03:00 PM  
Anonymous BHT said...

I think she's another in the army of leaches.
No doubt an innocent leach.
She only wants to suck you for 3% or so.
She wants it to go up and up.
I'm sure she's a very nice person.
I'm sure the template choice was an innocent one.

The problem is, other innocents are being hurt and she doesn't see or care about that.

Sep 14, 2006, 1:00:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I mean really, isn't this taking things a bit far? Judgements are being made on a person based simply on the choice of a template. Pointing fingers and making statements about a person's character simple because they used a template like yours? I say again -- it is a template! provided by Blogger -- not designed by you. It says right on the front page of Blogger... sign up, name your blog, pick a template.I doubt you were the first person to pick this theme, nor will you be the last. This is one of the reason blogging so popular, especially for beginners. You don't have to know how to design a site can just pick a template - like everyone else! If you feel this strongly about this, learn some basic HTML and customize your blog.

Sep 14, 2006, 7:54:00 AM  
Blogger fredtobik said...

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

Sep 14, 2006, 9:26:00 AM  
Anonymous ross valley local said...

Judgements are being made on a person based simply on the choice of a template. Pointing fingers and making statements about a person's character simple because they used a template like yours?

Dude, what are you talking about? He wrote:
"I like the theme...her blog...reminds me of something"

I've noticed a quite a bit of righteous indignation over several key posts here, and each time a motive was assigned to this blogger that's just not evident from their writing. Something to think about...

Sep 14, 2006, 9:45:00 AM  
Blogger Marinite said...

Did you know that Blogger uses templates?

Yes.

I doubt very much that this was done with any malice,

Me too.

Sep 14, 2006, 10:09:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

righteous indignation over several key posts here

It's called attacking the messanger and not the message with a little bit of bait and switch thrown in. The message is undeniable at this point. Some people can't accept that as their cognitive dissonance, denial, and self-justification can take them only so far. When they come to that point and can no longer asail the message, the messanger becomes the target. If the messanger cannot be attacked based on clear and obvious intentions of statements that he/she made, then motivations etc are fabricated from what ever thin excuse can be derived no matter how weak it is.

Sep 14, 2006, 10:20:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dude, what are you talking about? He wrote:
"I like the theme...her blog...reminds me of something"


I read that as being just slightly sarcastic. I don't believe it was meant as a compliment especially when the author follows that up by saying ".let's see how long it lasts". I think the " judgements are being made" was in reply to being referred to as a "leach".

Sep 14, 2006, 11:08:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

people are morons for buying in Marin anyway. Ugly little richy-rich enclave pasted onto the side of a fault line. People never learn do they.

Sep 14, 2006, 3:18:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"people are morons for buying in Marin anyway. Ugly little richy-rich enclave pasted onto the side of a fault line. People never learn do they.

Bravo!! Well Said!!
Can I move to whatever rock you crawled out from under?? NOT!!!

Sep 14, 2006, 8:35:00 PM  
Blogger clemente619 said...

Bear with me, but I feel a need to vent about realtors invading the blogosphere.

I’ve learned a lot via the blogs, not just about housing bubbles but a host of topics. What I value is the “wisdom of crowds” effect. A discussion topic is posted and people have at it. Statements are made -- preferably backed with sound reasoning, facts and source citations – and opposing voices challenge those statements. Often what results is a consensus that is more informed, substantial and accurate than any one individual could have created.

Ideally, in my view, the most important goal of blogs is to arrive at a closer approximation to truth. They are a forum similar to that found in any good educational institution.

Blogs also may serve a useful function in a democracy: creating a more enlightened citizenry.

Yeah, this may come across as preachy and pie in the sky (so tear into me with opposing viewpoints). And, yes, blogs are also populated by ignorance, insults and inanity. A good blog rises above that, however.

Now, turning our attention to realtor blogs, take the present cases of Warren Carreiro and Melissa Lyckberg. If they want to create a commercial web site, fine. But when they create a blog, that’s a different animal.

In Warren’s case, he posted a strong statement chastising the Marin Real Estate Bubble blog. No problem so far. But he didn’t allow comments on his “blog”. There was no way to challenge his statements, which turned out to be factually untrue (“I don’t think these numbers really came from DataQuick”), uninformed (unclear on the concept of year-over-year) or at least open to debate.

In Melissa’s case she proposes statements concerning Marin real estate, such as:

1. “Homes can be purchased for good prices now . . .”
2. “. . . experts believe the market is stabilizing, it isn’t about to crash!”

Responses to her blog questioning those statements have gone unanswered.

My assertion is this: these aren’t true blogs. They’re marketing tools masquerading as blogs.

Yes, realtors or anyone else can post whatever they want on the internet, but when you choose the blog form, most readers are going to bring to your blog certain expectations, which at a minimum include interactivity – I can write comments questioning and challenging your statements and you will respond with reasoning, facts and sources.

Maybe I’m wrong. Rip me at will.

Sep 14, 2006, 8:51:00 PM  
Blogger Marinite said...

I like the theme this Marin agent chose for her blog... reminds me of something...

In other words, "I like the theme this Marin agent chose for her blog". Why? Because it "reminds me of something...". Must I really point out what?

If you want to attack me... bring it on. But at least have a legitimate gripe with me rather than making stuff up.

I left a comment on her top (9/12/06) post with a link to this blog...let's see how long it lasts. I posted it today at 2:55 PM.

I am so accustomed to being flamed and demonized for daring to question Marin and its real estate market and for actually holding certain things higher than profit and greed, and given the comments about me and my blog on the Carreiro blog (not to mention the IJ and a few others who shall remain un-named), I automatically made a cynical assumption about Melissa's blog (the blog that this post points to) which is what the quoted material above betrays. So sue me.

But going over to Melissa's blog and discussing my blog and me there is not appropriate IMO. If you have issues with me, then keep it here.

And yes, I check my blog's comments multiple times every day...even when on vacation if possible. However, I don't always choose to participate in the comment thread because I have found that the thread is often more informative if I stay out.

Sep 14, 2006, 10:48:00 PM  
Blogger marin_explorer said...

But going over to Melissa's blog and discussing my blog and me there is not appropriate IMO.

Right, but either way, that realtor got more than she bargained for!

Sep 14, 2006, 11:25:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Responses to her blog questioning those statements have gone unanswered.

The responses and comments that clemente619 is referring to on Melissa's blog were all made within just over one day. One day!

clemente610 made several comments all in that one day. Some comments, made within a few hours of each other, taunted Melissa because she hadn't replied yet.

I'm not naive. I understand the blogging community expects a quick response but I also would like to believe that as a community they understand not everyone can post hourly or daily.

My assertion is this: these aren’t true blogs. They’re marketing tools masquerading as blogs.

A true blog? A blog isn't "true" simply because a response wasn't made quick enough for you?

I'm sure you are right that there area some blogs out there being used more for marketing purposes (of course this isn't just Realtors) but I think you might have been a bit quick to make a judgement in this case.

It's just my opinion but I didn't get a "marketing tool" feeling from Melissa's blog. It felt "true" to me.

Sep 14, 2006, 11:41:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I left a comment on her top (9/12/06) post with a link to this blog...let's see how long it lasts.

You say yourself that you are used to being flamed so you must have known that pointing to another blog and saying "reminds me of something" and then wondering "how long it lasts" had a feeling of *wink-wink* *nudge-nudge". that could result in flaming Melissa's blog.

I did see that you said on Melissa's blog you were "sorry to have inadvertantly brought this on to your blog."
What better way to wrap this all up.

Sep 14, 2006, 11:55:00 PM  
Anonymous lbc said...

anon -

Stop all this self-rightous BS. This holier than thou, 'if I can't attack Marinite based on the facts then I'll put words in his/her mouth, imagine hidden motivations and agendas, and attack him/her on issues of social grace and tact instead' is absurd.

You are like a little child who if he can't win an argument, acts out and looks for any little point in what someone says and jumps on them for it no matter how trivial it is.

Sep 15, 2006, 12:26:00 AM  
Anonymous bHT said...

I stand by my leach comment.
I mean that in a kind and loving way.
Leaches are being used in legit medicine to suck off toxins.
They are a natural part of the food chain.

I retract my reference to other innocents being hurt by her.
I don't know her or her business.
I was lamenting my personal experience with a friend who got some really bad advice and went with it.
This advice came from some very highly respected Marin RE and mortgage folks.

Sep 15, 2006, 12:29:00 AM  
Anonymous lbc said...

"that could result in flaming Melissa's blog."

So according to your ethical framework it seems that marinite should not point out realtor blogs because doing so makes him/her responsible for how readers of this blog behave on those other realtor blogs?

why should marinite take responsibility for how other people choose to behave?

Sep 15, 2006, 12:31:00 AM  
Blogger clemente619 said...

Just a quick observation about Melissa's blog.

When I first posted there, anonymous comments were not allowed. Now they are.

Who has the ability to turn on anonymous posting on a blog? The blog owner, of course.

So, anonymous/Melissa both here and at your own blog, just post under your own name. It makes things much easier.

Sep 15, 2006, 6:49:00 AM  
Blogger the backi said...

Marinite, as a longtime fan of yours I am sincerely disappointed with this entire posting and related comments. Usually, you are so incredibly insightful and talented, and you are at your best -- in fact one of THE best -- when you provide facts, figures, and opinions on the market. However, when you post unsolicited critiques or sarcastic comments about other individual's sites, whether they be blogs or websites or whatever, you completely lose your credibility and become just another one of the herd. Perhaps you got really rattled by the Warren character, but there's no need to attack (or make satirical comments about) other individuals. Now you have diverted this blog from being a hard-hitting intelligent read to an immature mudslinging contest. I'm going to come back tomorrow and hope you're back to doing what you do best and what most of us highly RESPECT you for.

Sep 15, 2006, 7:12:00 AM  
Blogger clemente619 said...

Anonymous/Melissa said:

”A true blog? A blog isn't "true" simply because a response wasn't made quick enough for you?”

No, “quick enough” isn’t the point. You’re posting (albeit as “anonymous”), you’re just not addressing my original point.

I’ll restate it again. The entry on your blog from 6/18/2006 aims to persuade buyers that contrary to changing opinion, now is a good time to buy. Why is it a good time to buy? According to you:

1. “Homes can be purchased for good prices now, and the choices are much better.”

2. “It's no longer the top of the market, but experts believe the market is stabilizing. It isn't about to crash!”

3. “Real estate is a great investment for the long term.”

I disagree. I asked you these questions:

Can you define "good prices"? For example, how do median prices today divided by median salaries/wages compare to the past? How about median prices divided by median rents?

Can you provide sources for your statement "experts believe the market is stabilizing?" Are these independent experts or real estate industry experts?

Regarding "It isn't about to crash!" Are you prepared to guarantee that in writing?

You don’t have to respond. That’s your right.

But in my view, the owner of a blog should respond to direct and legitimate questions.

Do you disagree.

Sep 15, 2006, 7:13:00 AM  
Blogger clemente619 said...

Mea culpa.

I've been sarcastic and disrespectful in some of my posts here and at Melissa's blog.

I'm sorry and that will stop.

It detracts from the message.

Sep 15, 2006, 7:34:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

But in my view, the owner of a blog should respond to direct and legitimate questions.
Do you disagree.


Not at all. I was simply saying give her a reasonable amount of time.

Who has the ability to turn on anonymous posting on a blog? The blog owner, of course.

I can see how you might think that. But I can assure you that this is not the case. Melissa has already addressed these comments on her blog.

So according to your ethical framework it seems that marinite should not point out realtor blogs because doing so makes him/her responsible for how readers of this blog behave on those other realtor blogs?

lbc,
I am sorry, my intention was not to imply she was responsible for other people. I only meant to say that in this environment pointing a finger will probably result in flaming.

Maybe we can learn from this and think before we post.

Have a good day everyone.

Sep 15, 2006, 8:38:00 AM  
Anonymous lbc said...

"When I first posted there, anonymous comments were not allowed. Now they are."

clemente619 -

Are you saying that you think Melissa is postiung to this and her own blog as anonymous or some other, non-identifying handle? That would explain the childish/immature things one anon is doing here.

Sep 15, 2006, 9:45:00 AM  
Blogger clemente619 said...

Ibc,

Yes, unfortunately that is what I'm saying. Only the blog owner can toggle between allowing/disallowing anonymous posting. It think it's pretty clear.

So it goes.

Sep 15, 2006, 10:01:00 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Yeah, not to beat this to death, but look at this from anonymous:

"Some comments, made within a few hours of each other"

If you go to the realtor's blog, the entries are just dated -- no time stamps.

Furthermore (I know, what is this, forensic investigation?) look at this from anonymous:

"I don't claim to speak for Melissa"

But then later we have:

"But I can assure you that this is not the case. Melissa has already addressed these comments on her blog."

So, she doesn't speak for Melissa but then she does.

Funny. That's all it is.

Sep 15, 2006, 10:44:00 AM  
Blogger Athena said...

good grief... you know, it would seem that if you enter a profession and create a blog site one would at least grasp the idea of intelligent dialogue. Not just grasp it, but be prepared for it, and have stats and data to help boost the old credibility factor and give the buyer a reason to feel good about using their services.

Cracks me up that so many realtors en masse seem so averse to having discussions that involve sound logic and a bit of math. I hate to make this generalization, because I know that as with any profession there are going to be hacks... but geez louise... some of these people make the stereotype of realtwhores look good.

Sep 15, 2006, 11:29:00 AM  
Blogger marin_explorer said...

so many realtors en masse seem so averse to having discussions that involve sound logic and a bit of math

Right, they're more than happy to sound convincing if it helps a sale, but once questioned on their assumptions, they take offense at critiquing their "pollyanna philosophy". Seriously, this strikes me as really flaky.

Realtors need to realize this isn't some pollyannish mental game, but homebuyers are making critical financial decisions. They deserve good information, or in its absence, cautionary advice.

Sep 15, 2006, 12:03:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

First I want to say that I'm sorry to Marinite - I had no idea this would turn into the monster it has.

I didn't claim to speak for Melissa and I still don't claim to speak for Melissa. I set up her blog and manage the set up - which explains the anonymous comments.

The way that my comments were received and the harsh replys to some very simple statements left me wondering if the fact I knew Melissa would have become more of a focal point and not my comments.

My ONLY reason for joining this discussion was to point out that many blogs look similar and the similarity wasn't done with any malice.

At the point when the comments started to refer "hurting the innocent", "RealTWhores" and how she wasn't responding "now" I felt it was becoming more judgmental than a form of discussion.

Sep 15, 2006, 12:24:00 PM  
Blogger Marinite said...

Please, stop. This has gone to the point of utter absurdity. Unfortunately, Blogger does not allow me to turn off commenting on just one post. If I could, I would have by now. My only alternative is to delete the whole post but I won't do that (yet).

So just stop.

Let this be the last comment in this post.

Sep 15, 2006, 12:28:00 PM  

Post a Comment

Links to this post:

Create a Link

<< Home

Terms of Use: The purpose of the Marin Real Estate Bubble weblog (located at URL http://marinrealestatebubble.blogspot.com/ and henceforth referred to as “MREB” or “this site”) is to present and discuss information relating to real estate and the real estate industry in general (locally, state-wide, nationally, and internationally) as it pertains to the thesis that recent real estate related activity is properly characterized as a “speculative mania” or a “bubble”. MREB is a non-profit, community site that depends on community participation and feedback. While MREB administrators do strive to confirm all information presented here and qualify all doubtful items, the information presented at MREB is neither definitive nor should it be construed as professional advice. All information published on MREB is provided “as is” without warranty of any kind and the administrators of this site shall not be liable for any direct or indirect damages arising out of use of this site. This site is moderated by MREB administrators and the MREB administrators reserve the right to edit, remove, or refuse postings that are off-topic, defamatory, libelous, offensive, or otherwise deemed inappropriate by MREB administrators. You should consult a finance professional before making any decisions based on information found on this site.

The contributors to this site may, from time to time, hold short (or long) positions in mentioned and related companies.